While I am glad that you are enjoying kids, I do not think it is fair the way you paint the picture of people who choose to not have kids ("feeling sorry for them") as if it was a condition or something. Plus I think having children is not something that should be rushed. Pretty sure there are many parents out there who became a parent because of social pressure.
What if I tell you I find fullfilment in travelling? Should I feel sorry for people who do not want to travel (or can't because they have kids ;) )?
I agree with 3) though that a job should be just a means to the end.
> I do not think it is fair the way you paint the picture of people who choose to not have kids ("feeling sorry for them") as if it was a condition or something.
It's not painting childless folks as having a condition, it's more kindhearted than that. It's saying, "Here's this thing that's incredibly difficult but infinitely rewarding. I care about you so I want you to experience it too".
Take that comment with an assumption of good intentions, and you can get to a specific situation like: "oh man, that particular guy really has nothing going for him, if he had kids it would look a whole lot different". BTW, I feel like "that guy" sometimes, and it's probably quite common.
If you don't have kids you are missing a fundamental understanding of what is driving most people each and every day. You are clueless about most of the world because most people have kids and it profoundly affects them. You can't know this unless you experience it yourself.
It's also difficult to understand what you are getting into by having kids. It brings on a profound level of anxiety about their feelings and ultimate happiness. Your world is not yours anymore. You don't control them and you can rarely fix them. Anything that makes them sad is like a stab to your heart that requires immediate action. Imagine having a kid that does not have any ambitions and struggles to find any happiness and has problems with drug addiction. Get ready to have your soul ripped out.
Not having kids prevents this very possible outcome and allows you to focus on pampering yourself with your millions your whole life...with the side effect of perhaps coming to the conclusion that your own life is meaningless somewhere down the road.
If you reach a certain age and are still childless just know that nearly everyone will feel sorry for you.
The world does not revolve around single people...at all.
> If you reach a certain age and are still childless just know that nearly everyone will feel sorry for you
I legitimately do not care if people "feel sorry for me". I have good reasons for choosing not to have kids, and I hate the attitude that I'm somehow selfish or missing out on the "true meaning of life". Life is ultimately meaningless with or without kids. That allows you to make your own meaning, and kids are not a requirement for that.
There's this attitude that people who don't have kids are in some way selfish, but in my experience, the act of having kids can be the selfish one, especially if you are not in the position to be a good parent, for whatever reason. Many people have kids in that attempt to find meaning for themselves, not to actually be a good parent.
As a society, we need to be much better at not pushing every single person into being a parent. It just doesn't work for many people. And that's okay.
> The world does not revolve around single people...at all
Its in the code. If many people thought like you our species would be extinct. The people that have this software version is the majority and any argument you make will not alter the code. Their code includes convincing others to make kids.
The way I think isn't "people shouldn't don't have kids", it's "don't force yourself to have kids if you don't want them, and don't expect kids to be the path to solving your own problems -- they may, in fact, just magnify every problem you have". I'm fairly certain that even everyone agreeing with that wouldn't lead to the extinction of the species, but it may lead to less children being raised in dire or abusive circumstances, and less parents miserable with their own existence.
I agree that this way of thinking probably runs contrary to the evolutionary code of the species. But we live in a world where that code is outdated, and education should allow us to teach people that marriage and child-rearing, while the right path for many people, is not the only route to self fulfillment and happiness. And those that choose alternate paths should not be treated as, or feel like, outcasts.
It's actually not that difficult for childless people to imagine what having kids is like. What I imagined before I had kids was pretty close to what it ended up being once I had them.
I also don't think I've ever experienced my fellow parents feeling sorry for somebody our age without kids. It's more often jealousy than anything else. A lot of people have kids because it's just the next thing you do and then they end up regretting it.
Not everybody is created equal. I love my kids, don't get me wrong. But I also know people that live for their art, their skill, their ability to help others and so on.
> If you reach a certain age and are still childless just know that nearly everyone will feel sorry for you.
Nearly everyone is a pretty large assumption, I think you speak mostly for yourself, not for 'nearly everyone'.
> Nearly everyone is a pretty large assumption, I think you speak mostly for yourself, not for 'nearly everyone'.
Exactly this. Additionally, I've known a number of parents that deeply regret having kids, and look on child free friends with envy, not sorrow.
It's not a socially acceptable view for them to have, so they generally keep it secret. And the majority of them still love their children, but have a very complicated relationship with the whole parenting situation. People don't want to talk about it, though, because it can come off like they hate their kids, which usually isn't the case.
We need to teach people from a young age that choosing not to have kids is a perfectly acceptable choice, if that's what they decide they want.
That's ok to feel like that but you are basically arguing that if I don't want children I have a meaningless life and that I am a second class citizen of Earth and the only purpose of life is to have children.
Having a child is a huge responsibility. It's not just something you can try out and see if it works for you or not.
Honestly, I think you are in a parent bubble or something. I don't quite understand your hardcore stance on must-have children.
I don't have children but I have a pretty good idea what it's like. I think many childless people (over a certain age) do. Turns out people are really good at this empathy thing; it's something that's strongly hard-wired in our brains.
> Not having kids [..] allows you to focus on pampering yourself with your millions your whole life...with the side effect of perhaps coming to the conclusion that your own life is meaningless somewhere down the road.
That seems an unfair characterisation; I don't have children for the simple reason that there are enough humans on the planet; it's not like there's a shortage. Many childless people I know feel like this.
I'd actually love to have a family; I just chose not to (thus far anyway) because I think it's better for "the greater good", which sounds a bit lame but that's what it is. You can agree or disagree with that take, but it's not pure selfish hedonism like you're describing; quite the opposite in fact.
Maybe didn't mean you, but the GP's "I have a hard time to see any relevance in a life without children anymore. This might be complete bs but certainly floats my boat." That sounds like it could make a kid think "So they didn't have me for my sake, just so they could find 'relevance' in their life".
I don't think there is ever someone who decided to make kids only for their own kid's sake because you don't know your child before they are brought to the world. Or least this is very hard to grasp.
Of course, adopting is a different wonderful way to have children where you can meet the child. But also in this situation: are you choosing one for their own sake or for you own sake?
PS: I have a kid and think a lot about the responsibility of parents to their children due to the fact that the parents decided to bring the children into the world.
What if I tell you I find fullfilment in travelling? Should I feel sorry for people who do not want to travel (or can't because they have kids ;) )?
I agree with 3) though that a job should be just a means to the end.